----- Original Message -----
From: Adelaide Institute
Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 10:14 AM
Subject: From Fredrick Töben: Dialogue rather than them-us hatred!
From Fredrick Töben:
Dialogue is better than them-us hatred, and Israel defender and Holocaust believer Barry Chamish has accepted our invitation to be a speaker at the 24-25 April 2004 Sacramento Revisionist Conference.
That reminds me how I attended the 'Hate on the Internet' conference at the Australia Museum, Sydney, in December 2000, where I faced about 40 Holocaust believers, including Nizkor's MvVey, Hatewatch's Gold, Zionist supremo in Australia Jeremy Jones, England's Whine, etc.
The elderly gentleman who financed the two-day conference agreed with me that we must have the freedom to ask questions, then said to me: But you don't look like a Holocaust denier!
I explained to him that the use of shut-up words such as 'hater', 'Holocaust denier', 'antisemite', 'neo-nazi', etc. is designed mentally to enslave individuals who refuse to submit to dogmas, ideologies, politically-correct views, etc.
Our love of free speech, of embracing the creative impulse to liberate ourselves from mental oppression is a moral and intellectual value that gives our life its intrinsic meaning, it is what makes us a MENSCH!
Silence us, oppress us through legal processes, and you create the slave mentality to which we have no afinity. Remember, where truth is no defence, I want to break free!
Fear is the father of cruelty - and that is why I value knowledge because it liberates - and I oppose all those who attempt to stifle debate through intimidation and various other forms of oppression.
I thank supporters for the valued comments received on the threat made against me by allegedly Australia's JDL Terrorist Group. I shall undertake the necessary steps as recommended in many of the responses: inform the police.
FROM: REGIONAL DIRECTOR
JEWISH DEFENSE LEAGUE - AUSTRALIAN CHAPTER
It is with regret that your website is still active. The Jewish Defense League would be most
pleased if you would discontinue with your propaganda campaign and denial of the Holocaust with immediate effect.
Could we trouble you to confirm by return email that you will stop cease? We are hoping to her from you by the end of December 2003.
JDL is very active in Australia and always welcomes cooperation in these matters...
On behalf of all Holocaust survivors... thanks again in anticipation of your considerate efforts.
Thanks & regards,
And now a response from Barry Chamish who has accepted an invitation to address our Sacramento Revisionist Conference. I have asked him to address the matter of the role of the Spanish King/the Pope in the planned dismantling of the Zionist State of Israel, and how the one-worlders, the New World Order, will do this. Also, the direct link to this will be the Rabin assassination - but Barry will bring his books along and so this contentious theory [ so much so that Barry fears Mossad may be out to get him] will be aired as well at Sacramento.
Barry is a great conspiratorial expert, and as every human action is a 'conspiracy', [because wherever individuals get together, some action will be planned], Barry's presentation promises to be interesting.
We will also allay the fears his supporters have expressed that it will not be safe for him to attend. Revisionists are not violent people because truth is on our side, and we welcome debate on any topic in a civilized way.
Here's Barry Chamish with his thoughts.
----- Original Message -----
From: Barry Chamish
Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 10:36 AM
by Barry Chamish
The globalists prefer democracies over tyrannies because the former are so much easier to manipulate to their will. Take those recent Southern California fires, all started by escaped arsons working in well planned coordination. Not two months after the last flames are doused, Pres. Bush introduces a new forestry bill designed to prevent future fires by handing chopping privileges over every acre of the nation's woodlands to the logging industry in perpetuity. All it cost was a few thousand homes to conjure up the hellish images needed to push the bill through.
Michael Jackson is busted on child molestation charges and not three weeks later comes the announcement that a new anti-pedophilic surveillance system will be introduced to the playgrounds and schools of America, the value of which will likely exceed the logging windfall, plus the added bonus of a national consensus in favor of every neighborhood being watched.
With Saddam's fall, the Iraqis have traded in one dictatorship for another, more subtle one. Spreading democracy means spreading tyranny. Bending a people's will becomes so much simpler when the facade of freedom is instated. Take a look what's been happening lately in Israel.
The globalists are united in arranging Israel's demise and are busy reducing the country to undefendable borders. Are they ever busy! Most Israelis see the Beilin Geneva Accord as basically harmless, when it should be viewed as basically treasonous. Admittedly, the thought did cross a few minds that since the money behind it was European, they were being manipulated by foreigners. But no one uttered a peep when the front man for this funding was announced as one Alexis Keller, who funneled his father Pierre's fortune at Beilin. Papa Keller is VP of the International Red Cross of Holocaust ignoral fame and which singles out Israel for membership refusal. Nor did many understand the significance of Colin Powell of the Council On Foreign Relations inviting Beilin to his office to discuss his "useful" initiative.
The Geneva signing was a publicity stunt coordinated with the highest ranks of the Israeli government and media to fool the Jews out of their homes in Judea, Samaria and Gaza. Just previous to it was the murder of three disarmed soldiers, two of them young girls, in Netzarim, preparing the ground for the withdrawal from the village, but what interests us now are the days following the Geneva performance. Here are a number of incidents, seemingly unrelated, but they are not:
* A 90 year old former hack Jerusalem Post TV writer named Philip Gillon dies and Haaretz devotes a page to his removal from our midst. To give you an idea of what a despicable character he was; when the soldiers' vote of 1984 prevented a Labor victory, he wrote that his fondest wish was to see them all die in battle. The page consisted of two eulogies. One was written by Jerrold Kessel, CNN's Israel correspondent, yes the selfsame CNN founded by Ted Turner of the CFR, and other was written by P. Gillon's nephew Carmi Gillon; yes the selfsame former head of the Shabak and it's Jewish department, responsible for innumerable crimes including the Hebron massacre of 1994 and the Rabin assassination, which he planned with Shimon Peres. In his self-serving little piece of mind-twisting, he wrote that he had some personal problems with uncle Philip, who was just too left-wing for his tastes.
* If the irony of Gillon's parting words to his uncle were lost on the readers of Haaretz, the events surrounding another character in the Rabin assassination shouldn't have been. Dr. Yehuda Hiss was the pathologist who changed Rabin's wounds for the public. He also steals body parts from fallen soldiers, hapless tourists, and whoever goes near his scalpel. But these crimes didn't bother attorney general Elyakim Rubinstein who ruled that the Hiss crimes weren't worthy of prosecution. And not one editorial in the Israeli mainstream media condemned this ugly aberration of basic justice. The globalists know if the Rabin murder truth ever gets out, their primary agents in the Israeli government, those who brought us the joys of Oslo, will fall like kingpins and take their Oslos and roadmaps down with them. Media and court manipulation are the primary defences, but co-opting those who once fought to have the facts exposed is useful as well, as we shall soon see.
* After shutting down the popular radio voice of the Resistance, Arutz Sheva, the Shabak started rounding up those pesky local leaders who were likely to organize the fight against withdrawal. Fourteen innocent men have been arrested without charge, and placed in intolerable
prison conditions under an obscure but highly exploited procedure known as administrative detention. The most highly publicized case is that of Noam Federman, who is now a cause celebre in certain rightist circles. However, more than a few clear thinkers smell a rat here. The well publicized appalling state of Federman's incarceration is just too obvious. It serves the timely purpose of scaring away other protesters from public activity opposing the upcoming withdrawal.
* The climax of the manipulation were the announcements of the leaders of the Right that they favored withdrawal. Within two days of each other, Chief of Staff Mofaz ordered the removal of three outposts to begin with, and PM Sharon declared his unilateral withdrawal plan. But the greatest impact belongs to former Jerusalem mayor and Likud stalwart, the Trade Minister Ehud Olmert. In Stage One of his role, he agreed to specially label all products from beyond the Green Line, so importers worldwide can have an easier time of boycotting them. He may as well just have put a yellow Star Of David on the labels. Then, four days after the Geneva ceremony, he declared his advocacy of a near complete withdrawal from those places cited on the labels. AND the timing was not coincidental. By the weekend, Yediot Achronot's poll now showed that over half of Israelis favor withdrawal, with 58% favoring Netzarim first. This shattering change of public perception proves how well coordinated manipulation succeeds in a "democracy."
HOW THEY GOT TO OLMERT
Last night (14/12/03) I set my book table down at a rally against Olmert at the Jerusalem Theatre. Olmert was being given a freedom award by the Israel Media Watch, an act itself inconceivable enough to sow confusion. We now return once again to that Rabin assassination, which must be kept under wraps at all cost.
The gentleman who handed Olmert his prize was Yisrael Medad, not long ago a central figure in the battle to expose the events leading up to the murder of Rabin. In the months leading up to the assassination, the government-owned Channel One tv channel, its head Moti Kirschenbaum and a director Eitan Oren, staged two reports of a dangerous hyper-radical organization called Eyal, whose most prominent and only leaders were Avishai Raviv and Yigal Amir, both Shabak agents provocateur. Medad led the battle to expose this piece of deadly media manipulation, going so far as to submit a (losing) petition to the Supreme Court to indict Kirschenbaum and Oren for fraud.
Medad lives in those very territories which Olmert decided warranted special labeling and had to be withdrawn from anyway. So why would he give his sworn enemy a prize for media honesty? And there is more. An astute activist at the rally, Gemma Blech informed me,"I attended Medad's lecture at the Ariel College media conference last month. He went over some examples of media bias and repression but didn't once mention the closure of Arutz Sheva. After his speech, I asked him why and he walked away from me without saying a word."
The last person I would have suspected of such easy co-option would have been Medad. That means that everyone is a candidate for it, including, certain members of the Yesha Council.
The speakers at this rally, just didn't get it. They actually accused Olmert of jumping ship for political advantage. Nothing more sinister than that. But Olmert was blackmailed, or bribed, probably a combination of both and ordered to play ball with disaster. Only one suspicious lady at the rally said so: "They got him the same way they got Sharon, through his son. His second son Ariel is a homosexual draft dodger who has more than enough scandalous behavior to hide."
A good try but with Olmert, there is no need to go for his son. Olmert is a crook and always has been. Allow me to present a few choice snippets from my book, The Fall Of Israel (Canongate Publishers, Edinburgh 1992).
pp. 44-45 - Olmert, one of the priciest lawyers in Israel, was accidentally discovered to be one of the most unscrupulous also. !n 1987, police investigating the files of the North American Bank, which was involved in an embezzlement of at least $37 million, turned up some rather revealing information about Ehud.
It seems Olmert had directed a client to the bank who deposited $1.6 million. The client, according to Olmert's own explanation, was a criminal fighting extradition charges and Olmert felt his money would be safe in this obscure bank. And the bank appeared to be grateful for his patronage. Olmert was rewarded with a $50,000 loan, not a penny of which was ever returned. Naturally, such a classic case of corruption would be the end of Olmert's career anywhere else. But in Israel he is considered a candidate for the leadership of the Likud sometime after the present generation burns out.
pp. 284 - The Likud was smart enough to know that flouting the funding law too openly would cause a backlash, so it created some straw companies and a slush fund so that corporations could bypass the legal system...The people in charge of Likud Party finances at the time were Ehud Olmert and his accountant Menachem Atzmon.
pp.285-287 - The Likud pulled another rabbit out of its hat. Israeli law prohibits individual party donations from exceeding $10,000, a sum most Israelis couldn't amass anyway. The answer to its financial woes could be found in sympathetic foreigners if a way around the restrictions could be found. The devious minds of the Likud fundraising team came up with a beauty of a plan. It involved getting foreign multi-millionaires to guarantee bank loans for the party. Now, let's say the Likud couldn't repay the loans, well then, the guarantors would have to pay the tab. And who better to put the plan in action than Ehud Olmert? In March 1991, Olmert flew to London and Zurich on "ministry business." The people he met symbolize all the shady and rancid connections between the Israeli government and money...In London Olmert met with Robert Maxwell and an American magnate named Alan E. Kasaden. While in Zurich, Olmert met with Edmond Safra...
Revelations of Olmert's secret life appeared in Haolam Hazeh on June 24, 1991, and this episode epitomises all the dubious dealings American Jews innocently support when they donate to the UJA. The Jewish Agency sold a losing real estate company, Hachsharat Hayishuv to the Nimrodi family, of Iran Contra fame, in 1988. Yaacov Nimrodi purchased the shares from Bank Leumi, which is owned by the Jewish Agency, which funnels most American charitable donations to Israel. By the mid-1980s, Agency chairman Arye Dulzin, had a tacit agreement with Leumi chairman Ernst Yaphet. Yaphet agreed to let Dulzin do what he wanted with Hachsharat Hayishuv if Dulzin gave Yaphet a free hand at Leumi. Yaphet's hand stole $7.5 million from the bank and ran away to America with it.
Now every crooked deal needs a great lawyer, and who negotiated this theft? None other than Ehud Olmert. He arranged the sale of Hachsharat Hayishuv, supposedly owned by the donors of the UJA, to Nimrodi, who dumped the company at great profit to the Bernard Moss Group in Australia. After mediation, Nimrodi paid Olmert $400,000 for his role in the scam. Since Olmert was about to be sworn in as a government minister, he was forbidden to accept the money. So he resigned from his law firm and we assume the money got to him through other channels.
And these are just samples of Olmert's criminal activities. The same man who would feloniously arrange the sale of a company owned by charitable donors would have no moral problem selling his country the same way. If anyone bothered to actually investigate why Olmert had a political change of heart, they will surely find that he was given a choice: exposure for massive acts of felony, or take our bribe.
A few days before this rally, I attended a gathering of the Ariel College in Tel Aviv. An informed journalist took me aside and said, "Don't quote me. The last act before withdrawal is being planned. They're preparing to frame another Goldstein. Watch out for a massacre or an outrage along those lines."
A woman at the rally had just finished a radio interview. She said, "I was going to tell them there's another Rabin murder in the air. That's how they're going to remove us from our homes."
I asked why she didn't say so. She answered, "I was afraid if I did, they would let me talk anymore."
THE RESULTS OF THE HOLOCAUST DENIERS CONVENTION ARE IN
For those who weren't here last week:
One of my advocates is Frederick Toben of the Adelaide Institute of Australia, a notorious organization of Holocaust deniers. He started posting me four years ago and has continued well after it was clear to his readers that I despise Holocaust denial. In the past year, Mr Toben has admitted to me that he now understands that Jews and Israel are no more or less responsible for the troubles of the world than anyone else, a big step in his circles.
Last week he invited me to speak at a "Revisionist" conference in Sacramento next year, expenses paid and he sent me a program filled with despicable Holocaust deniers.
I wrote him back: "Are you kidding? A third of my family died in the Holocaust and you expect me to hobnob with people who believe they didn't?"
He replied that I he was giving me the chance to set the record straight. Because of that he explained that he was being vilified in his community."
I answered: "YOU'RE BEING VILIFIED IN YOUR COMMUNITY? IF I SHOW UP I'LL BE RUINED IN MINE."
I invited Joel Hayward - with whom I am just having an email exchange - and
But I am showing these people that now is their opportunity to speak in our
presence and state where we are wrong, misguided, in need of help, etc.
I am still waiting for you.
It's the personal touch that ultimately decides issues and events, mostly
anyway. Then again I do not see you as an enemy - but I am seen as an enemy by those
who have given me the various slanderous labels because they refuse to open
themselves to a basic discussion about this historic period that has gained
legal protection status, etc.
So, Barry, it's up to you if you have the moral and intellectual courage to
stand firm and speak - I did it and I recall how some individuals didn't
like me after they found I had invited you - but you you are an Israeli Patriot with a story to tell.
Ignorance is the father of cruelty - and I note this kind of affliction is
found in individuals around the world.
But it's up to you, obviously.
I wrote back saying I needed a week to give an answer. I cannot come to one by myself. So, I'd like you to decide. Please tell me if I should or should not attend. After a week, I'll count the opinions and go or not go depending on you.
I trust your wisdom and leave it to you. Mr. Toben's answer is now out of my hands.
Scroll down for the final results. A large number of people expressed their opinion. Here is a fair sampling of the responses.
I'm taking a moment away from my final project in one of my classes to respond to your email.
I personally think you should go. You are very articulate; you can present the truth factually and articulately, and you have the strength to stand up to these anti-semites. Many do not.
I think that God is giving you an opportunity and you should take it.
I vote for you to attend the Holocaust Deniers’ conference, but only if you come equipped with unequivocal evidence of the Holocaust’s reality, which can be convincingly explained and demonstrated in ten minutes or less.
I say go, I trust you not to compromise. But be aware that any time
someone in the future tries to bring your reports as a source,
they'll get: "Oh, the one who spoke at the Holocaust
Please attend the "Revisionist" conference -- and I pray for your success in promoting the truth at the conference.
Go for it, just be wary of the traps and
potential live "debates" they might suck you in
to. Include the Gentiles' requirement to hold by
the Seven Noahide Commandments and you'll have
them spell bound.
When you show them that Judaism considers the
Gentile to be a partner in Creation and not an
adversary they come around.
Barry those of us who have been communicating with you over the years ( I speak for myself...but ) know your heart. If you go then above all else your safety must be guaranteed.
My concern is not that your followers will think badly of you, NO my friend, my concern is the possibility that it may be you are being lured into a most dangerous trap.
My sinister mind sees what isn't said by the deniers. Their desire to stop the truth. Obviously the nay-sayers have an agenda of their own. Any semi-intelligent person cannot deny the truth of the holocaust and the fact that so many do is clear to me that they are not interested in truth but subversion for another goal. That goal being anti-truth is also anti-G_D in truth so not to be trusted in any way shape or form.
The question that troubles me is the importance of sending a man who has so much to offer and the immediate need to convince a group of people who, wanting to get to the truth of the matter and plenty of proof already available for their research, really choose to deny the truth in the face of the evidence.
No my friend, at first I felt what an excellent opportunity to spread the truth but! I must reconsider my own viewpoint and try to look at the opportunity for the deniers. This woud be a golden opportunity for them to close your voice and advance their own agenda.
But to the Holocaust deniers. This is a dicey issue.
There was a Holocaust because Jews sat back and thought everything would be okay. "We're Germans, they wouldn't hurt us." Etc. Jews always think that if they can appease those around them, they'll be left alone. And we have a history of being kicked out or killed from wherever we are.
We're not popular anyway. Will confronting lies, being the dynamic individuals our patriarchs and matriarchs were, make anything worse???
Go to them. Tell the truth. Be the one voice in the wilderness.
(Debunk The Protocols of Zion while you're at it.)
Let's imagine for a minute that your allegations ring true like a gold sovereign. In spite of all that, they detract from the really important work you do in exposing the control that the EU, the Vatican and the US wield over our beleaguered country through the various poodles they hold on a leash, like Sharon and Peres. In other words, don't give your detractors some more garbage to throw at you - till they themselves have had to throw in the towel.
Overall maybe you should go. As I thought about it I thought of Deborak Lipshitz who took David Irving to court. It needs a lot of thought and you have to know that you will be really allowed to speak...
I think you should ask a shayla about attending the
conference from a great sage.
Don't leave big decisions to people with email
addresses. It's not the Jewish way.
Concerning your dilemma of whether to speak at Frederick Toben's "Revisionist" conference in Sacramento next year, given what you would plan to do there, I would love to see you do it. (Have you considered asking a Rav for advice on this?)
You should only go to Sacramento if your
Jewish supporters say yes to the following:
1) After thoroughly researching their position
on the Holocaust, you give a statement denying
You parallel the dangers and the betrayal facing
the Jewish people today with that of the 1930s. I
have mentioned before Howard Katz's book, The
Warmongers. In it he says the Rothschilds vetoed
a French plan to stop Hitler in 1935 and even
loaned him 350 million pounds (1.75 billion dollars)
to buy weapons. All Jewish people who died during
World War II died after their betrayal by their self-
If you feel deep down inside that you would be able to truly educate ignorant people about the Holocaust and all expenses will be paid then go......
Our Sages in Pirkei Avot [Ethics of the Fathers] teach us that we should "know how to answer the apikorus - the heretic." Holocaust deniers are the heretics of our day, denying history to which we still have living proof of. My father, may he rest in peace, was American born, and served in the US Army during WW 2. I'll never forget the pictures he showed me in my youth of the piles of bodies from the concentration camps.
Assalamu alaykum wa'rahmatullahi wa'barakatahu,
(May Allah's peace and blessings be upon you)
Dear Mr. Chamish: Thank your for writing "Imagine there is no Beilin." For what it's worth, I think you should go to the "revisionist" conference. Your presence will, inshallah, open up some people's eyes and start a conversation among those who oppose the NWO, even if they originate from a totally different political place than you do. Your take on Lennon is most perceptive: he was a materialist (with an estate of $300 Million when he died) who preached a phony and nefarious brand of peacenik poison. But maybe, as you suggest, toward the end he was waking up a bit.
I believe the masters of the NWO are planning another holocaust, which will engulf Jews, Christians and Muslims alike unless it is stopped in time, and information, plus putting people on the street, is vital. We need to unite all those who believe in spirit over the godless machine.
Of course, you should accept the invitation to visit your Sacramento Convention.
But only if your benefactor will not print your name on the program and leave your
actual appearance to the mood of the people. He can announce that you are in
the audience, but hesitant of appearing at such an auspicious meeting unless
the members actually want to hear what you have to say. Leave it then, up to
My own personal view is that you definitely should go
to anybody who invites you, because you are truth,
which is light, and only good can come out of you
bringing light and truth to people, and you don't have
to tell everybody about it, if you know it will upset
In my eyes this is easy. If everyone was saying and thinking truth there would be no need for people like you.
Many people lie. Many Israeli's lie. We cannot let them. Given the opportunity we must oppose them. So my advise is: go and oppose.
It won't be easy, it will be a terrible experience I am sure but you are a Jew and an Israeli and so....made of strong stuff. Go for it.
Barry I think you have got more guts than any of us put together.
1. On one hand I would not agree you going because I do not think they will be civilised to you. I think they might want to harm you physically, so if you decide to go get someone with you for protection.
2. I know that if you go it will be good in the sense that, they will see someone first hand, who suffered the Holocaust, who suffered the loss of his family who is not afraid to talk with this mob. They see you, standing against them who has balls and strong mind. I think from educational point of view to have such mensch like you, talking to this mob is a good idea.
Good luck I wish I was guarding your back. For, I do not trust these one sided, biased scum.
If you are waiting for others to decide for you - you are in bad shape.
Barry - I think you should go to the anti-Holocaust group, for the reasons stated. HOWEVER, Please let us know the dates, so you can be covered in prayer!
Remember those who survived the gas chambers by scraping food. Do you hear their cries at night when they remember?
(As we age or become very old, the past becomes the present)
Remember the hatred between Polish Jews and German Jews once inside the camps (that was exploited to the max!). Speak out so the kehilah will not turn against each other but rather unify. The hour is far past.
Carpe Diem. . not in the true meaning of the Latin phrase (which was drilled into the heads of young virgins prior to sacrifice)
but rather, seize the hour, seize every opportunity, ride the momentum (with caution and intelligence).
If you go to make the attempt to open a few ears and eyes... be sure to take at least 2 other trusted friends with you... and, if possible, hire private security you can trust for yourself and your companions... and be sure to wear a kevlar vest underneath your shirt... On the other hand, consider the possibility that this may be a plot by your many enemies among the NWO folks to arrange for your demise (chas v'shalom!) and blame it on these Aussie holocaust deniers... This is a very high risk situation for you- physically as well as politically and economically....
Personally, I vote: "Go for it! AND wear the vest... AND hire security you can trust.
I say go and throw phosphorous grenades at them.
I don't like the idea of your attending a Nazi function only because the
idiots there may pull a violent stunt, (paid by Arabs or the Mossad) thus
"conveniently" depriving us of you- G-d forbid. Too risky. If not for the
crazies and evil ones, I would happily endorse your going to speak to the
stupid ones who are along for the ride.
My vote is thus no.
Why would Holocaust deniers have a meeting in Sacramento California,of all places?? What does this have to do with our body builder governor?
Go and speak the truth to them Barry! If you don't, who will?
If you keep this in mind, you'll understand why all these
anti-discrimination organizations like ADL and Simon Weisenthal Center are
wastes of time and money. They obviously can't change a divine decree. In
your specific case, you addressing the anti-Semites of that conference
won't change their minds or improve the global Jewish situation a single
wit, notwithstanding this fellow's professions of fairness and equal time
I would suggest going to the conference. If you get there and it turns out to be washed-up fascists who are still debating if
Germany could have won, then leave. And enjoy California.
my two cents
and vote ...
go forth and conquer....
but.......keep a simple focus:
your job is to convince them
to do so you have to (as I am sure you know)...you have to know what arguments they have that can show that ANY aspect of Shoah was controlled or even h'oz va shalom-ish...caused by Yidden.
I say that you should....and bring a holocaust survivor with you.
Regarding this conference in Sacramento with this Toben character, permit me to to be so bold as to say to you-DON'T GO!
Not only does the injunction against throwing pearls before swine apply here,but you could be risking your safety as well. The Jewish People need a living and talking prophet more than they need another murdered Jew.The cause of truth will be better served by your staying where you are,where your enemies are already sufficient in number.
Attending this meeting may not be very beneficial for the Jewish cause because:
1. it will take a VERY knowledgeable person about that period to refute their stupid claims. Note that real knowledge and authority is required even though the claims are plain nonsense. Going there and failing even on a marginal question (e.g. what did Himmler have for breakfast on the day he visited Auschwitz, etc.) will damage your cause.
2. nothing will help. Even if you prove them you are right, they will still remain the bunch of antisemites that they are now.
I prayed a quick prayer about the holocaust deniers conference and "got"
"Go ! Beard the lion in his den!"
Here is my vote, go and set the record straight. However, please do not speak on Shabbos, even if you are there and are otherwise participating, do not bring your defense in the memory of the six million murdered on Shabbos, the holiest day in our collective souls, the one day that we proclaim that there is One G-d who created the heavens and the earth and all that we see and do not see and the One to Whom we must all give an account.
Personally, I think you should go and speak to this Holocaust denier group providing you are prepared for the prevailing idiocy and direct refusal of many of them to consider all the facts.
Constructive debate cannot exist between disputants who totally
So if you can agree about no alleged historical facts with the others
at the convention, you will have nothing constructive to say to them.
Get it in. Be safe. Make your statements. Acknowledge their 'concerns' and get the friggen hooter OUT OF THERE....
Please go and speak to them. What harm could it do? If you merely speak to people you agree with, you will never resolve anything. You won't be legitimizing their position. You will only be legitimizing their humanity. Your presence will legitimize Jewish humanity to them. Opponents without names or faces are easier to fear and hate.
It is obvious to me that you have impacted Mr. Toben over time. I believe that
G-d has given you an opportunity to speak to people that would NEVER read
your books or join your e-mail family. If you could reach just one person
with the truth he could reach one of the others etc. etc. Hopefully the
whole organization would disintegrate and become supporters of Israel.
Barry if you do, take others with you to support you and pray for
you. You will be in the enemy's camp.
I think you should accept this challenge. There is always the chance they
are trying to get you there in order to murder you. You are at risk of that
right in your own country, so why let it stop you!!
I would strongly recommend you to refrain from taking any part in that "Revisionist" conference in Sacramento, unless you have a taste for playing the role of Jewish jester in that banquet of anti-Semitic blood-suckers. Holocaust denial is one of the lowest human manifestations. Considering the overwhelming evidence of the Holocaust's atrocious nature and scale, one should be either hopelessly brainless or a pathological anti-Semite or any other form of subhuman being - in order to become a Holocaust denier. All in all, Holocaust denial is an irreparable degeneration of the human psyche. Stay away from vampires, for all they are interested in is the scent of Jewish blood.
I will tell you a little story that you probably don't have time to read but it may help you decide whether to go head to head with the Jew haters.
In 1973 I was attending UCLA studying Political Science. I was also a reporter on the student newspaper the Daily Bruin and editor of the Jewish student newspaper Ha'Am (which I helped to establish fighting the anti-Semitic campus authorities, the blacks and Mexicans, and took our fight to the Regents of the California Universities - but that's a story for another time). In my capacity as reporter for the Daily Bruin I volunteered to cover the visit of Stokely Carmichael of the infamous Black Panthers to the UCLA campus (there weren't any other volunteers). In retrospect it was pretty stupid on my part but I was young, stupid, unmarried and full of romantic fighting blood, out to defend the Jewish People.
Carmichael showed up in the student auditorium before an audience of a close to a thousand students, the overwhelming majority of the darker version all wearing the happy faces of the "bad brothers" of the early 70s. Along the side aisles and flanking the invited guest were really happy faces with sunglasses. I was one of only a handful of white students and two of my Jewish friends who accompanied me kept whispering to me: "Are you nuts? Let's get out of here!"
Carmichael launched into his usual Afro diatribe laced with gems like: "Where-ever you plant corn in America you get corn. And if you plant African in America you get African!". And after building up his black brothers into proud Africans he urged them to go fight at the sides of their African brothers against the Jewish-Israeli imperialists who were trying to steal their lands and enslave them. In preparation for his talk I had read his book (whose name I no longer remember) but I was impressed with his grasp of economics. To this day I recall his analysis of employer-employee relations whereby he illustrated in great detail how the people who do the work should own the fruits of their labors rather than their taskmasters.
After the talk and question time came I was the first one at the microphone. "Mr. Carmichael, I read your book, "_____________" and I noted how you show that workers should own the results of their own labors rather than their taskmasters".
"That's absolutely right", he answered.
"If that's the case, then the Jews who were enslaved by the Egyptians should own all the pyramids, all of the cities like Raamses they built for the Pharoahs, and a good portion of Egypt itself".
Dead silence. 1000 astonished and very angry pairs of eyes were pointed in my direction. The two closest gorillas stiffened and took half steps in my direction. My two buddies were already at the door. Carmichael himself was speechless at my unexpected statement and my audacity in actually confronting him. "Uh, well, uh the Egyptians had the plans" he stammered trying to weasel out of his own theory and still defend Africa.
"Mr. Carmichael, you are an anti-Semite. And you want black Americans to go off and fight in a war that is not theirs, to help the Egyptians try and genocide the Jews in Israel. Is that how you propose to have black people achieve freedom and equality - by going off and joining in a religious war with the Arabs? It was the Arabs who sold the blacks into slavery! The Arabs have 22 states, the Jews have one tiny little state but that's one too many for you."
I turned and walked away. My heart was pounding and I really thought I would be spending the next couple of months in the hospital, if I was lucky. But although there were a few muffled comments no one touched me and I quietly left.
That little encounter was not meant to change the opinions of the people gathered there. But I think it did succeed in showing every person in that auditorium that there are Jews who will stand up and fight back. That day was one of the proudest in my life, not only for me personally, but there was a solitary Jew on the UCLA campus who stood up to Stokely Carmichael and called him an anti-Semite to his face.
You have a much better opportunity to fight the anti-Semites. You have an open public forum and as much time as you need, not 60 seconds to ask a question at the end of an orchestrated show. You will not be reviled as an "attendee" at a holocaust denier's convention but respected as a proud representative of the Jewish people. You can do more in one such evening than the Holocaust museum can do in a year. And in the worst case scenario, that you are unable to disprove a single one of their lying evil theories, or change one single person's position, you will have still proven that there are Jews who will stand up straight, look them in the eye, and tell them: Never again! We no longer hide - we fight!
I would never have guessed it. In fact, I'm amazed. 88% said go. So, trusting the collective wisdom of my readers, I am accepting the invitation to speak in Sacramento, I believe in late Spring.
As long as I'm being flown to the States, here's a chance to meet me. I have prominent pastors and rabbis on my list. Invite me, and I'll speak to your congregations. If you don't happen to be in the theological field, ask your synagogue, church or group to invite me. I'm going to be in the States anyway so the cost of getting me where you are should be very reasonable.
My books are:
Who Murdered Yitzhak Rabin
The Last Days Of Israel - Israeli Edition
If you want to order them, e-mail me at firstname.lastname@example.org
And to get those books donated to the skeptics of Israel:
Nakhal Zohar 40/2
Modiin 71700 Israel
And do remind your Hebrew reading friends to visit: http://chamish.tsedek.com
And your English-reading friends:
I bow to the collective wisdom of my readers. I'm going. Now since
----- Original Message -----
From: "Barry Chamish" <email@example.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 5:08 PM
Please make a correction if possible. I have been informed that
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